So, How Was It For You?

Sep 21, 2017 30 Comments

It’s been a busy summer of travel, conferences and clients making me remiss in the blogosphere, which makes now the perfect time to say: “So how was the garden retail business for you in 2017?”

I was guilty-as-charged in being distinctly bullish about prospects for a banner year this year. The economy is firing better for most (though not all) people than it has done for years. We see a soaring stock market, rising household income and talk of a $1000 cell phone. Landscapers and housing contractors are sold out for months (years in Utah, so I am told), while there is just enough inflation around to encourage some much-needed price raises. It should have been a banner year, just like 2016 should have been too. But neither year reached the expectations of retailers that I know. I see reports that one of the home centers is up 6% in sales across the board, but much of that was contractor-driven. Meanwhile plant and hard goods suppliers I know say it was “just so-so.”

Two steps up, two or more back

Most independent garden retailers saw a modest, 2-5%, rise in sales, but a smaller or flat traffic count with a compensating rise in Average Sale, just like the last 15 years. But rises in sales were largely due to the price rises that I (and others) urged retailers to adopt. Given the ever-rising costs of business some might even say they went backwards despite an increase in the top line sales. Yes it was a poor weather year for many, but there has always been weather – this is something else.

So I am officially declaring that for the first time in my lifetime, the DIY garden business hasn’t surged after a recession – and it’s not going to under the current model. There has been such a fundamental change in the consumer’s lifestyle and demographics since 1983, 1990 or 1999 that history is not a good guide here. What worked for the last 45 years isn’t working.

Let’s analyze before we strategize

But before we “de-construct,” as they say in trendy circles, let’s hear what happened from the trenches: your trenches. I have good data that shows the DIY sales leaders this year were such categories as indoor plants, (green and/or blooming), succulents, edibles, pottery, personal (think purses, jewelry, apparel etc) and self-indulgences (everything from big blousy hydrangeas to YETI). Meanwhile normal-sized “color” was flat and “woodies” were down significantly in DIY business (unless you have lots of new homes locally).

In other words, consumers decorated a lot… but didn’t dig much.

So, how was it for you? What were your category winners and losers? Did you see “decorating” as a major revenue stream and invest in it, or were your buyers still buying like it’s 1997?

I look forward to hearing from you as we “re-construct” the garden retail business together!

  1. peter mezitt
    Sep 22, 2017 at 6:43 am

    Ian – We see the trend of DIY “diggers” dropping each year. We are very much the traditional plant-based garden center and are not known for the decorations beyond the usual seasonal items. This year we invested a lot into making our facility a lot more shop-able which did help drive more people through our registers and our sales transactions are actually up slightly year over year.. But this is following a year with pro-longed extreme drought which brought in fewer customers. So even with generally good weather this year, improvements to our facility as well as a much more effective loyalty program that drew people back more often, we only saw modest improvements to customer volume.

    Looking back at our customer volume 13 years ago really demonstrates what’s going on. Back in 2004, there were a lot more DIY planting folks shopping with us even with almost twice the amount of independent garden centers in our area competing with us. Obviously a large piece of the grab and go lines has swung over to the box stores and the grocery stores. But with large landscape size trees, shrubs and perennials we sell, its lack of time or interest from the 30-50 crowd and fewer 55+ folks are gardening.

    Like many others, we are focusing on making our store experience more attractive to the millennials. Our brand is strong and our efforts will be to offer great experiences around plant themes (workshops, events, attractive merchandising, etc.). We will also continue to expand our services to take more of our expertise to people’s homes (garden consultations and design work) in order to expand in the growing segment of DIFM (or do most of it more me). Long term, we will continue down the road of expert advice and mobile services based on landscape projects. But we will also reconstruct our facilities and business model into more consumable product lines such as local food or unique gift lines that can draw people in more regularly and help flatten out our very cyclical plant based business.

    1. Ian Baldwin
      Sep 22, 2017 at 12:18 pm


      Thanks for taking the time to begin this important conversation with some excellent points. Knowing how far you have come in the last few years (and seeing your place just last week) tells me you are on the right road here. Your decline in sales of large “woodies” since 2004 validates our thoughts, as do the order books of the Do It For Me companies. I don’t think this is just a reflection of consumers feeling more affluent than in the recession, though DIFM does rise and fall in line with the economy much more directly than retail sales do. This is something different. Thanks again!

      (BTW: Peter is Peter J Mezitt of Weston Nursery in MA and a descendant of the original PJM for those “woody” folks out there)

  2. Darin Van Houten
    Sep 24, 2017 at 9:20 am


    We are almost entirely color retailers. No gift and very minimal hard lines. We do carry pottery and Bumper Crop soils. Our overall sales are up about 10% for the year. Annuals and perennials have flattened out a bit for us, only about 6-8% increases for them this year. PW hydrangeas were a big winner. We sold about twice as many as last year and had customers still asking for them after we were sold out. We had a huge increase in pottery, around 150%.

    I’ve started bringing in a limited selection of woodies over the past few years. This is our biggest increase from last year, almost 200%. I debate over weather or not to dive deeper into nursery. It means more staff, more watering, and much more inventory, especially over the winter. It’s nice to close the doors after Christmas and not have any live things to worry about until we reopen in the spring. It would also lead to the debate over weather or not to offer planting services. However, we get more and more customers asking us to carry more trees and shrubs. We have 2 nurseries in our area, but they are more landscaper focused and customers complain regularly about having to shop at them. At the same time, customers tell us how much they love shopping at our place. We are complimented daily. I’m confident this would equate to a healthy nursery business if/when I decide to take the plunge. It seems customers are growing tired of having to trudge through a nursery yard to buy shrubs and would prefer a more refined shopping environment.

    1. Ian Baldwin
      Sep 27, 2017 at 7:24 pm

      Darin, it’s so good to hear of your increases, after your brave move and start-up a few years ago. Diving headlong into a wide selection of “woodies” when we see it declining as a DIY category doesn’t seem a winning idea, especially as you outlined some good reasons not to in your note. However if you can judge the risk to go into more “decorative” woodies and set a maximum inventory of say $30,000 in-going inventory (I made that number up!) that you could take a 50% loss on, it might be worth it. Can you quantify “more and more customers asking us,…”? 2 a week, 10 a week, 25 a week? Are they serious repetitive customers or people just looking? Can you find an aggressive grower willing to share the risk in some way? Maybe this is a phone call between us…. But thanks so much for joining the discussion here and for you business results, best wishes and Go GCU!

  3. Bob Buchwalter
    Sep 24, 2017 at 1:03 pm

    Hello Ian,

    Good to see you at Arett show. We raised our prices this year after reading your blog in the spring and had no complaints from any customers about the higher prices. We had a 7% increase in our average sale which was partly because we raised prices and partly because we are promoting the 2 year guarantee with Bonide root n grow on nursery stock which also requires buying some type of compost or soil amendment. We included perennials in the two year guarantee at our own expense because it get our customer to plant our plants the right way adding compost and fertilizer. We sold out of all soil amendments by end of June. We also continue to sell our own branded fertilizer which this year we have sold 1100 units of 1.5lb jars at $9.99. Every year we sell 1 to 2 hundred jars more than the previous year. Our hanging baskets sales went through the roof by as much as 20% increase and turning down customers late in the season.

    Our customer count is also up 8% this year as well. This is partly do to doing more classes, selling gift cards to non-profit for fund- raising events before the start of spring, and my daughters taking over the website and posting more on Facebook, twitter, and social media. We saw a lot more millennials in the store this spring. My youngest daughter changed our web page weekly so it always was synced with what our weekly ads were doing. We are doing wedding in the garden center July – January and it results in a lot of people coming into our store for the event which most of them have never been there before and then coming back to shop at a later date. It has been great ex-poser in that way. Our nursery sales have risen slightly over the last two years as housing is starting to increase slightly but is still down by 50% since 2006, Just don’t see that coming back anytime real soon. Hopefully it continues to increase over the years. Pond sales and water gardening is still 50% down as well since 2006 but are starting to have more interest in installing or changing out liners for DIFM crowd as they know how much work is involved. PWs still seem to be taking ground in both nursery, perennials, and annuals. All in all our sales are up 15% over last year which last year we had a 9% increase. Again not all is due to selling plants but renting out our garden center as a wedding venue. We feel blessed to have such a good year and are planing on repeating it again next year. It is a strange feeling to have a little money in the bank at the end of the year. Planning on doing some much need repairs and maintenance as our “New” garden center is now 19 years old. That’s our news in NE Ohio.

    1. Ian Baldwin
      Sep 27, 2017 at 7:51 pm

      Bob, good to see you too. It seems a few years since GCU 2004 and the England tour!

      I am so glad to hear of your success as I remember the first few years you had with your “new” GC after we worked together on it. Is it really 19 years ago…? Your secret sauce is obviously that word “daughters” and how they have brought a new focus and used social media to raise your company’s image with a whole new generation of shoppers. Your sales numbers should be encouraging to other readers some of who have had a flat two years while the economy showed general improvement.

      My question is, did you raise other costs such as labor or did your pick up those increases without incurring more overheads? In other words through improved productivity? Do you track Sales per Labor Hour?

      I assume you are using that beautiful red barn for weddings and that sounds a smart idea. Thanks again for your results and the reasons behind them – very helpful to others. Have a great Fall in sunny Ohio!!

      1. Bob Buchwalter
        Oct 5, 2017 at 5:27 am

        Ian, Our sales per hour of labor went up about 12.4%. We did give our employees raises, but did not increase the hours of labor. As for our big red barn, I have not used it for wedding yet, but we are in the process of seeing how much it would cost to either move it or have it disassembled and rebuilt somewhere on our property. I might be calling you in the near future as for some of your ideas.

  4. Ron Vanderhoff
    Sep 25, 2017 at 12:40 pm

    From Southern California,
    I hope this dialogue runs deep and long and gets a large amount of comments. Certainly at Roger’s Gardens we think it is one of the most important conversations out there.

    In SoCal we have been feeling the shift from digging to decorating for some time. Demographics, psychographics and lifestyle changes seldom lie and all the indicators point to “digging” as a significantly smaller part of our businesses now and in the future. Selling landscape plants, soils, fertilizers and all the other items consumed over the past couple of decades is looking more and more like it will not get us through the next decade or two. The change is REAL.

    Probably the most obvious illustration that we can offer of this digging-to-decorating shift is in our gardening supply business. The traditional gardening (digging) categories of fertilizers, pest control, soils, tools, gloves, hoses/watering, ties/tags/supports, seeds, etc. is down 6% to last year (in spite of a five year drought ending). We were down the prior year as well as the year before that.

    In stark contrast, the decorating gardening categories of hanging decor, door/porch, wall decor, tabletop decor, garden lighting, miniature gardening, spinners/stakes, birds/wildlife and related items are UP OVER 50% to last year.

    And this trend is year after year on these decorating vs. digging categories.

    Additionally, and something Ian didn’t mention is customer spending on experiences and entertainment. At Roger’s Gardens paid workshops are continually selling out, our restaurant is filled every day to capacity, ticket sales to store events are growing and “experiences” at the store, like our Halloween room, our food tastings and our Spring and Christmas open houses are bigger than ever.

    Yes, the change is huge out west. Not even sure what we should call ourselves in the new world, but “gardening” and “nursery” might not fit our future language.

    Brilliant Ian, “Decorating, not Digging”. You nailed it.

    Ron from Roger’s Gardens, Orange County, CA

    1. Ian Baldwin
      Sep 27, 2017 at 8:18 pm


      Once again I really appreciated your insights from the Rogers’ perspective.

      You and I have discussed this for years now but your numbers and trends will be an encouragement to other readers faced with these changes just as Rogers was a trend leader in previous decades.

      If any part of the nation quickly embraced DIFM for the heavy work it would be Orange County CA and we will have to see how that translates to areas with fewer disposable dollars. DIFM closely correlates to the rise and fall of the general economy so time will tell if “decorating” is also a good-times activity!

      It was interesting to read of your progress in “experiential” shopping and others might wonder how you are monetizing them?

      Once again thanks for taking the time and for your kind words. Let’s keep the conversation going!

      See you soon,

  5. Edward Knapton
    Sep 27, 2017 at 1:48 pm


    This is quite a bit different but Klein’s a grower retailer with 4 children two of which at least want to come into the business which is about 7 miles from us is spending at least they have told the newspapers 2 million dollars on a renovation project of their garden center. They are on the busiest road in Madison – East Washington and Stoughton Road. Complete concrete foundation for greenhouses to bolt the nexus greenhouse’s to and a two story concrete and brick facade building about 5,000 sq ft. 20,000 sq feet of greenhouses plus about 20,000 sq ft of old production hoop houses in back. Any ideas as to how much this will effect sales? We are down 5% in sales and about 3000 less transactions due to the 26 days of rain in May and about 15 more in June.

    1. Ian Baldwin
      Sep 27, 2017 at 8:20 pm

      Ed, great to hear from you, I hope you are doing well. This topic is more of a one-on-one phone conversation, call me, I’d love to discuss it with you! Thanks.

  6. Tina Bemis
    Sep 27, 2017 at 8:03 pm

    People just don’t plant in the ground anymore. In my little town, it is quite depressing. Drive around and it’s rare to see flowers on doorsteps, let alone in the ground. It’s not that customers are shopping at the chain stores, they are just not interested in what we sell the way they used to be.

    I drove around to my competitors two weekends ago, and their parking lots were just the same as ours. So it’s nothing that my business is doing wrong. It is something that our indistry is doing wrong.

    I served on the Plant Something Massachusetts board for five years to see if I could help change things on the state level. Lots of work for not much fruit.

    One thing that I have tried, since I don’t seem to get millenials, is to contact senior centers. I understand seniors. I have added thousands of dollars in sales taking my workshops right to the senior centers just past peak season. They are grateful for a workshop, and I am grateful to use up surplus (not leftover) inventory. Libraries and schools, too. I don’t wait for the phone call. I actively recruit these groups.

  7. Ian Baldwin
    Sep 28, 2017 at 5:14 pm

    Tina, great to hear from you again, thanks for joining in this thread. Your observations about in-ground planting mirrors what we are seeing and I am so glad that your unique workshop programs have taken off for you as a source of revenue.

    I do think the glass is half full on planting though. Isn’t planting in pots for “Decorating” still planting? If sold well it might even raise the average sale per customer given all the potential tie-ins and the price of larger decorative pots….

    Hope you are having a great Fall season!

    1. Tina Bemis
      Sep 28, 2017 at 6:39 pm

      Agreed. But gardening in pots, unless on drip, can actually be more time consuming for customers. At least in my own yard. I plant tight and mulch so there is very little weeding. Yes, there is the initial hole digging, and some watering, but once they take, much less so. Alas, I cannot change the world. Let people buy containers, if that’s what they want.

      1. Ian Baldwin
        Sep 29, 2017 at 6:39 am

        Thanks Tina, I didn’t know that people returned to the blog to see if I answered them (I’d better watch what I say!)

        “Decorating” covers a multitude of sins from tacky to gorgeous but if you can grow and sell large gorgeous planted containers for all those summer events that consumers have, it means a longer season of cash flow and an impressive average sale. In spring you can sell the “kit” (irrigation and all), with a coupon to return in summer to re-fresh their plant material. I know one GC which even charged good money to clean, store and replant people’s containers through the winter, driving at least two more store visits per year.

        Thanks again, go GCU!

        1. Tina Bemis
          Sep 30, 2017 at 11:26 am

          Of course we do:)

  8. Don Shor
    Sep 28, 2017 at 7:15 pm

    Up about 12% this year. Edibles continue very strong, with spring vegetable sales outstanding. Shade trees increased. Low-water landscape plants continue to sell well, even with the drought officially over. Perennials always good. The category that just won’t stop is succulents.

    1. Ian Baldwin
      Sep 29, 2017 at 6:51 am


      Nice to hear from you, 35 miles away in Davis!

      I have to admit I thought edibles would have peaked by now; it started in the recession days of 2009 but continues at full steam, even morphing into hops for home brewed beer and chickens-in-cities.

      Glad to hear of your uptick in trees, maybe the rain helped that trend and you are right-on with the seemingly endless succulent surge. What about general “woodies”? Your’s is a plant-person’s GC, so are you seeing the same downward trend?

      Thanks, it looks like a great gardening weekend for both of us!

  9. Jill Denney Dunsmuir
    Oct 2, 2017 at 1:36 pm


    We at Portland Nursery have never sold many lifestyle/gift items, and that hasn’t changed – what has changed is the huge boom in houseplants this year! It seems all of the homes being sold, demolished, and rebuilt as apartments and condos has finally started to alter our sales. It’s clear that customers want to bring gardening indoors or on to a balcony if they can’t have a backyard.

    Woodies are a smidge down. Color, hardgoods (especially glazed pottery), and houseplants are all up. The most significant being houseplants revenue up 26% (every single hp category was up quantity sold). Deliveries of huge houseplants are up and our instore pot-ups have increased in price and frequency, people aren’t into DIY as much as they use to be.

    Portland will for sure be thinking about expanding our indoor houseplant space in our remodel!

    1. Ian Baldwin
      Oct 3, 2017 at 9:03 am

      Thanks Jill, great report from Portland! The houseplant business has been building for a while and, together with veggies and herbs, has been a great entry-to-gardening category for millennials (as you would know!).

      Several of our more urban clients have seen the same thing, though I think it has been especially strong in the North West. So those garden retailers who let houseplants go to the grocery or home stores are missing a valuable starter category, plus all those great tie-ins!

      It’s quite a cycle, every 30-40 years, young first-time homeowners discover that they can fill a room pretty economically with “green furniture”. You can get a lot of tropicals for the price one average shelf unit or room divider!

      I worry a little bit about the supply of houseplants after the FL hurricanes, so if anyone has intel on that please share!

      Thanks again for joining the conversation, best wishes to all.

  10. Jeff Griff
    Oct 3, 2017 at 7:31 pm

    Greetings all,
    Ian, you are hitting on all cylinders with your message… all our gains are due to aggressive price increases. We feel our traffic is heavily reliant on events, promotions and sales… more and more we are in the entertainment
    business. In the words of Tom Petty, our woody sales are “free fallin” as is anything that requires digging in the ground. Container gardens jumped in over 100% this year… we were not prepared for that! We are still selling woodies however we must provide not only the planting service but also the planning. The baby boomers who built our businesses are done… they have moved to condos and are no longer digging. Millennials have affected a swift and dramatic shift in our stores with their buying habits… they never will dig. We are left with a core customer who seeks information and services to decorate their outdoor living spaces. Neither group is shy about spending money on what they want but it is a new day, a new deal and we need to adapt as quickly as our clientele is changing. More so than ever, when we open the doors it is all about the show. We need to charge more especially at peak sales periods… think of variable ticket prices for sporting events. Your lilac is worth $40 in August but it is worth $99 on Mother’s Day weekend. My greatest dilemma is building the staff necessary to meet the demands of my growing business.
    I realize business dynamics have always been fluid but I have to believe we are experiencing more dramatic change than our industry has ever seen.

    1. Ian Baldwin
      Oct 6, 2017 at 3:06 pm


      Thank you for your profound words here and for sharing your thoughts about the future of garden retailing. I have to agree with everything you say, except that as a boomer I am not done! My generation has certainly downsized and changed their priorities, in some cases to spending on grandchildren or travel rather than on their garden. But many of us still outspend our younger neighbors, though we are more selective on what we do or what we pay others to do.

      The National Gardening Survey still shows “over 55 years old males” as the group with the biggest spending (but much of it on machinery and power tools), while over 55 year old females have reduced their spending on conventional gardening. However they are very much involved in the above-ground and decorating trends.

      Your comments on entertainment are right on the mark, as are your thoughts about variable seasonal pricing – something the “big guys” have done for years. I’d love to see that in the garden business, reflecting the opportunity cost of space and resources in May.

      I know how you two have invested in your future at Lowe’s Greenhouses and I believe that companies like yours will continue to win market share off those who resist or even deny the need for change in a rapidly changing environment like the current one.

      Thanks again for sharing your thoughts!

  11. Ken Lain
    Oct 5, 2017 at 2:44 pm

    Right on track with L&L Reno talk today.

    1. Ian Baldwin
      Oct 6, 2017 at 3:16 pm


      It was good to see you yesterday at the L&L Show, thanks for coming to my talk (and for staying!).

      As we both know, the current hand-holding sales model that has worked well for many independents for 40 years will not be sustainable (or even welcomed by the consumer) in the next 5-10 years.

      This means a double-hit for “woodies” which tend to be more information-heavy than color – hence my talk about Silent Selling and simplifying the shopping process.

      Let me know how your transition is going when you have a chance please. Thanks again.

  12. Bill
    Oct 13, 2017 at 12:22 pm

    If I observe what is taking place in the SF Bay Area, many young professionals are buying homes that have no garden. They are moving into “box” condos and apartments, thus have only the inside to decorate with living plants. I also have seen a void in effective or motivational plant and flower use (i.e. gardening) It would seem that with the “baby boomers” retiring and slowing down, they might turn to gardening. I don’t view anything at Home Depot’s garden or places like Armstrong’s, for example that would reflect that as an opportunity. Everyone talks about WHAT they see, but not enough about WHO they are selling to. Gardening, as you know, is a personal thing, so lets make it personal.

  13. Ian Baldwin
    Oct 16, 2017 at 10:51 am

    Bill, greetings and thanks for taking the time to share your Bay Area observations. Few parts of the country have property prices like the Bay Area but you might be seeing an early trend with national implications! I agree that the retailers who approach this topic more specifically (selling the benefits to customers who have the money but not the time or inclination to learn) will win the business from the more traditional types.

    Houseplants/tropicals are booming right now in our more urban clients, especially in the west, so I hope they are connecting with their consumers in the way you suggest.

    Thanks again for sharing your thoughts, best wishes.

  14. TN
    Nov 6, 2017 at 10:51 am


    I sent an email to ian@ianbaldwin.com .
    We look forward to a discussion with you.

  15. kathleen wheaton
    Nov 7, 2017 at 3:30 pm

    It was a mixed year for sure. Customer count up. $ per sale down a bit. Our service side was up 250% and would have been even more but good labor impossible to come by. We were telling 8 plus people a day we couldn’t do their jobs. & most were big dollar jobs. At the same time however the nursery itself struggled to gain a 12 % overall increase. People no longer want to DO IT they want IT DONE FOR THEM. They get home, they want the yard groomed, the pots deadheaded and fresh. They come in nursery they want it big, they want it in color and ready to go. They buy a lot of gifts, and a lot of instant WOW. they want a LOT of info. They want to be ‘smart’ about what they are buying. We are NOT changing fast enough to keep up with them. WE need a much ‘smarter’ more up to date way to interconnect. We need to understand their needs, because we are NOT selling to their parents, and if we don’t change, as an industry, we will be in deep trouble. Thank you Ian, as always for helping to guide us through choppy waters.

  16. Gary Matsuoka
    Nov 7, 2017 at 8:06 pm

    We are a small retailer-grower. We grow about 1/4 of the plants we sell. We purchase from just a few wholesale growers because we do not trust the sustainability of most of the plants being grown.

    I have asked many “young” homeowners about their gardening experience and I get a lot of the same answers.
    “I want to grow plants…I buy them…plant them exactly how I was told to do it…and they all die”. After a while they give up.

    I blame the products being sold.

    50 years ago woodies were grown in real dirt (mostly sand). My father grew the majority of his plants in 100% sandy loam. He had the same plants in containers for 5-10 years with little problem (water daily, fertilize monthly)

    Now most are grown in compost. I have seen the results in my own garden. Plants grown in 80-100% forest products seem to die within 3 years (many within 6 months). Plants grown in mostly peat moss generally survive.

    We routinely rescue plants in our displays by replacing the grower’s medium with our soil that is 2/3 mineral.

    Some plants (grass, lily, conifer) can tolerate compost as a soil, but a lot of desirable plants (gardenia, protea, citrus, avocado, plumeria, etc) fail.

    We have classes every season explaining to our customers how to fix plants before they plant them.

    Field grown b&b woodies were the most fail-proof plants ever sold.

    Woodies grown in forest products are causing potential customers to find a different hobby they can have success in.

    I have communicated with several horticulturalists (associated with colleges) who promote a compost growing medium and none will even consider real soil as a suitable medium for containers.

    I don’t believe there is a wholesale grower that can guarantee that their container grown woodie will look decent beyond 6 months if left in the pot.

    My father was a bonsai artisan. Most of their plants were good for 5-10 years before renewing the medium.

    We have to provide a better product.

    We have been growing plants in media not containing composted forest products for 2 decades.

  17. Judy
    Nov 10, 2017 at 8:08 am

    Sales at our grower retailer greenhouse and container nursery in the piedmont NC are up 19% for the year as of yesterday. I see more woodies- trees and shrubs going out. Mums were an early saleout. Pansies are up. Vegetable plants are up. We are thinking about starting sales of house plants. We sell only plants and supplies, not decorative pots or decorations. Poinsettias and geraniums are big sellers. Perennials are up.

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